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米英両首脳による民主主義談義

米英両首脳によるステートメントの後、記者団との「民主主義談義」の中から、一部を抜粋しました。 このシンプルでストレートな論理が、大統領選勝利の理由の一つであろうことは良く解ります。 小泉さんも褒め殺しにならないように注意しないと!

Bush: Well, you can be elected and then, you know, be a strongman, and then you get voted out, so long as you end up honoring democracy.

But if you're true to democracy you'll listen to the people, not to your own desires. If you're true to democracy, you'll do what the people want you to do. That's the difference between democracy and a tyrant.

And the Palestinians may decide to elect a real strong personality, but we'll hold their feet to the fire to make sure that democracy prevails, that there are free elections. And if they don't -- the people of the Palestinian territory don't like the way this person is responding to their needs, they will vote him or her out.

And the reason why I'm so strong on democracy is democracies don't go to war with each other. And the reason why is, the people of most societies don't like war and they understand what war means.

And one of these days the people of the Palestinian -- the Palestinians will realize that there is a bright future because freedom is taking hold: a future that enables their children to get educated; a future in which they can start their businesses; a future in which they're certain that the monies going into the treasury of their government is being spent fairly, in a transparent way; a future in which corruption is not the norm; a future in which rule of law prevails. And that leads to a peaceful society.

I've got great faith in democracies to promote peace. And that's why I'm such a strong believer that the way forward in the Middle East -- the broader Middle East, is to promote democracy.

I readily concede there are skeptics, people who say democracy is not possible in certain societies. But remember that was said right after World War II with Japan. And today one of the people that I work closest with is my friend Prime Minister Koizumi. And it's remarkable to me that we sit down at the same table talking about keeping the peace in places like North Korea and it really wasn't all that long ago in the march of history that we were enemies.

The prime minister knows Koizumi. He's a good man. And he's an ally because democracy took hold in Japan. And yet there was a lot of skeptics. When you look at the writings right after World War II, a lot of people said, You're wasting your time to try to promote democracy in Japan.

There were some, I suspect, maybe in Great Britain and I know in America, that were writing, You're wasting your time to promote democracy in Germany after World War II.

And yet, fortunately, people who preceded us had great faith in liberty that transforms societies. And that's what we're talking about is taking place.

And it's hard and it's difficult to go in a society like Iraq because the terrorists understand the stakes of freedom, and they're willing to kill people in brutal fashion to stop it.

And I believe we have a duty and an obligation to work to make sure democracy takes hold. It's a duty to our own country. It's a duty to generations of Americans and children of Great Britain to help secure the peace by promoting democratic societies.

Blair: First of all, I should say Koizumi's a good man not just because I know him, but... Although that helps a lot I think. But I think the president said something here that I really think is very, very important.

In the politics -- when I was first a member of Parliament and making my way up the greasy pole and all the rest of it, there was a view in foreign policy that you dealt with countries on the basis of whatever attitude they had toward you, that really whatever they did within their own countries that was up to them and didn't really make a difference to your long-term relationship.

I think what we are learning today is that there is not stability of any true, long-term kind without democratic rights for free people to decide their government.

Now, that doesn't mean to say we try and interfere with every state around the world, but it does mean that there's been a shift, and I think a shift quite dramatically since 9/11, in the thinking that is informing our view of how we make progress.

Blair: That's why it wasn't enough to go into Afghanistan and root out Al Qaida or knock down the Taliban, we actually had to go there and say, no, we must replace that with a democratic form of government. Because in the end, if we replace it simply with another dictator, then we'll get the same instability back.

That's why in Iraq we decided when Saddam was removed, we didn't want another hard man coming in, another dictator. Now, it's a struggle because democracy is hard to bring into countries that have never had it before.

But I've no doubt at all that the Iraqi people, given the chance -- and indeed you can see this in some of the local elections now down in the south of Iraq -- given the chance, they want to elect their leaders. Why wouldn't they?

I mean, why would they want a strong-arm leader who's going to have the secret police, you know, no freedom of speech, no free press, no human rights, no proper law courts? The people want the freedom. What we recognized, I think, today, is that we're not going to have our security unless they get that freedom.

So when we come to the issue of Israel and Palestine, I think, what we are saying is, we are going to work flat out to deliver this. But people have to understand we can't deliver something unless the people whom it affects actually want it to happen.

And we don't believe there will be a viable future for a state of Palestine unless it's based on certain key democratic principles.

Now, I think that's a tremendous thing.

And I also think that in the end -- of course, you're right. People can vote for the people they'd like to vote for in elections, right? That's what democracy is about. I think we've got to have some faith, though, in the ability of ordinary people and decent people to decide their own future.

Because it's a curious thing, you look at all these Eastern European countries -- Central, Eastern European countries in the European Union now, just democracies over the last 10 years, fierce election debates, changes of government, often difficult circumstances when the governments changed.

But you go to those countries and talk to the people there, and their sense of liberation and their sense of self-worth as a result of the freedom they have, that is the best testament to why it's sensible to have faith in democracy.

And, you know, sometimes when people say, Well, it's -- you got a Republican president and a progressive politician from across the water, but in my view, people from different sides of the political spectrum should be able to come together to argue that policy case, because democracy is something that should unite us whatever political position we have.

Q: Mr. President, first. The prime minister is sometimes, perhaps unfairly, characterized in Britain as your poodle. I was wondering if that's the way you may see your relationship.

And perhaps more seriously, do you feel...

Blair: Don't answer yes to that question...

(LAUGHTER)

That would be difficult.

- New York Times 11-12-04 -

<抄 訳>

「民主主義ゆえに小泉首相と親密」と米大統領

「最も親密に仕事をする相手の一人が、私の友人小泉首相だ。」 ブッシュ米大統領は 12 日、ブレア英首相との会談後に行った共同記者会見で、小泉首相との親密な関係をわざわざ持ち出して、高く評価してみせた。 大統領選の最中にも何度か言及したが、今回は中東民主化は可能だという論拠に使った。

ブッシュ氏は中東民主化を進める理由について「民主主義国どうしは戦争をしないからだ。 民主主義国は平和を促進すると強く信じている。」と説明。 「民主主義が根付かない社会もあると疑っている人がいるのは知っているが、戦後も日本についてそう言われたことを思い出してほしい」と日本に触れた。

そのうえで「最も親密に仕事をする一人が私の友人小泉首相だ。 同じテーブルについて北朝鮮などの平和維持を話し合うのは注目に値する。 お互いに敵だったのはそう遠くない昔だからだ。」 さらに「確かに彼はいい男だ。 彼が味方なのは、日本に民主主義が定着したからだ。」と語り、民主主義の効用を強調した。

- asahi.com 11-13-04 -


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